[Roger3]

I have a Sub 2000 in the .40 S&W. Serial # 121XX.

The rifle has some serious ejection problems.

Some shells get flung out (good), some shells just drop out (not good), and some shells remain in the receiver and cause serious jams (xxxxx). The gun jams about 10 times per 100 rounds fired.

The last trip to the range caused a new one. The gun fired, and the bolt jammed on its was back. The spent shell was still attached to the bolt head. It took considerable force to pull the operating handle back to complete the cycle. This happened twice out of 100 rounds. The other 8 jams were the type that it tried to load the next round while the spent shell was still in the chamber.

I need help, wait no, I am ok, my gun needs help.

Now this is what I have tried so far.

Sent the gun back to Kel Tec after I shot it the first time.
Kel Tec lightened my trigger pull from 20lbs to 9lbs which was a great improvement, installed a metal clip, and said the ejection problem would work itself out once the gun was broken in. At that point it only had 50 rounds threw it. And at the time it did not seem like a serious issue.

I have tried Federal, American Eagle, UMC, Winchester USA, CorBon, most in 135gr, 165gr, and 180gr. None work 100%. Now the Winchester 180gr, JHP (person protection) do better than the others.

I have done a Fluff and Buff polishing the important parts until they shine. I have tried lots of oil, very little oil, and even lithium grease. But it is still jamming. And now I am up to about 500 rounds threw it.
And I only use new Factory Glock magazine, several of them. Still jamming.

So I have been on the phone with Kel Tec and they (Marty and Justin) feel confident that the problem is the extractor. I tell them my extractor looks fine, but they are confident and they mail me a new one. The one I get in the mail looks different from the one in the gun, so I call them and Justin tells me that he sent me the right one. I take some digital pictures send that to him and now they are convinced they did send me the wrong extractor.

But this is where it gets strange.
They tell me to install the “wrong” extractor in the gun, test fire it and let them know if it corrects the jamming problem.
So I have installed the “new/different” extractor and it hand feeds and extracts the rounds fine. But I have not shot it yet. I am a little concerned.

But then I thought maybe there has been a design change to the extractor for the 40cal Sub2K. Or maybe this is how Kel Tec fixes Sub2ks with ejecting problems.

So if you have a SUB2K would you look at your extractor and let me know what type you have? I will include pictures to clear things up.

And does any one have any ideas on what else I might try to help out my favorite carbine?

Here is a picture of the original extractor (large claw) that came with my gun.

 

[Roger3]

Here is a picture of the new(small claw) extractor.
This is the one I just installed.

 

[GunDude]

Roger3,

Might want to look at the ejector. It might be bent or tip broke or bent and broke. I say this in that you new problem left the empty case still in the bolt head, which leads me to believe it did not make contact with the ejector as it pass it or the bolt did not cycle far enough back to eject the case.

 

[GunDude]

Now, that I re-read your post, it almost sounds as if the metal reciever tube or something right inside the ejection port area, is catchingrubbing the bolt on it way back, slowing or jamming it and not give enough reward momentium to eject the casing, or just strip it from the extractor and leave it inside the ejection port reciever area.

Roger3, on your last outting to the range and the casing was still in the extractor, did the bolt head make it past the ejector.

 

[Roger3]

"on your last outting to the range and the casing was still in the extractor, did the bolt head make it past the ejector"

No, the bolt head did not make it past the ejector. In fact it seemed to be jamed on the ejector. But on that day it still fired and ejected 90 rounds correctly. These two jams happened around round 25 and 65 (estimate).

"Might want to look at the ejector. It might be bent or tip broke or bent and broke"
The ejector looks OK. But I don't have a new one to compare it to. But it is not bent nor is a piece broken off of it.

"it almost sounds as if the metal reciever tube or something right inside the ejection port area, is catchingrubbing the bolt on it way back, slowing or jamming it and not give enough reward momentium to eject the casing"

Yes, I feel this could be the problem. Because I have noticed that the more powerful the ammo, the less the gun jams. CorBon and Winchester person protecting, jam about 3-5% of the time, where as UMC and Win USA jam about 10% of the time.

Thanks for the advice GunDude. Tomorrow I will carfully inspect the metal tube and see if anything needs some more 600 grit sanding.

 

[Roger3]

update

Well the new extractor and some more buffing did not work. Its still jamming.

But I noticed something new. The firing pin is striking the primers way off center. Its striking the primer allmost on the edge. I looked at some of the old shells from privious range trips and it has been doing that the whole time.
I wish I would have noticed that before.

So I called Kel Tec, and they said to mail them my bolt, and they would exchage it out for a new one. I mailed it off this week and now waiting for a new bolt. I hope this fixes it.
:?

 

[Roger3]

Sorry it took so long for an update.

Well Kel Tec send me a new bolt head and a new bolt head carrier, and they look better quality than the ones that came with the new rifle. The extractor is even alittle different from the original.

I gave it the standard fluff and buff and took it out to the range and fired 180 rounds threw it. UMC, Winchester, and American Eagle.

It shot much better. I did have one failure to feed and 3 failure to eject.

It use to jam about 10% of the time and now it’s down to 2%. So I am thinking, this is the best my sub is going to get.

This question is for those who own the Sub2K in 40calibur.

How often does your sub jam?

Is one round per 50 about standard?

 

[ACK]

I had a similar problem with a 40SW Sub 2000 (Glock mag, don't recall what yours is). My problem: Before putting round 1 through the mag, I was showing my son how to load/unload...a safety precaution I go through with all new guns, using snap caps. Took out the magazine, a small piece of metal falls out, turns out it's the ejector.

I was sent a whole new bolt assembly from Kel Tec. The new ejector was much "flatter" than the old. Unfortunately, I don't have pics for you, but it was definitely a different angle. This one worked fine for 500 rounds or so, no jams.

However, the other day, I had a jam similar to what you've described. It was hard, and I was unable to pull the bolt back. The brass was stuck essentially in line with the barrell. My solution was to pry the brass sideways slightly with a small screwdriver. As soon as it moved the slightest bit, casing popped right out. After inspection, I tried a couple more rounds, worked fine for another 50.

I was using cheaper ammo than normal, and on that day I had about a 3% jam rate. However, up to that time, it was 0%.

For what it's worth. BTW, I've written Kel Tec about this, but too recently to expect an answer.