Stand your ground +

[Barksdale123]

Florida's Stand Your Ground law just handed more power to homeowners
By Maggie Crane, WINK News

Story Created: Aug 19, 2009 at 9:55 PM EDT

Story Updated: Aug 19, 2009 at 10:23 PM EDT

Florida's Stand Your Ground law just handed a lot more power to homeowners.

The law allows you to use deadly force for self-protection. Now, a new court ruling says you can shoot -- even if the attacker is retreating.

This all comes after a Tallahassee man, who had been charged with first-degree murder for standing his ground, was released from jail last month. Wednesday's ruling confirms the reason for his release.

http://forums.myspace.com/p/4591852/...orums.viewpost

[mr surveyor]

cool... I believe we (Texas) officially adopted our "stand your ground" statute in Sept 2007. Prior to that the legal requirement was to "attempt" to retreat, and deadly force was only to used as a last resort....usually too late if the actual law was adhered to.

For us, "stand your ground" is defined as being any place where the person has the legal authority to be armed.....home, work, city park, traveling in their personal auto, wallyworld parking lot, etc. If deadly force is warranted, the "attackee" has NO legal requirement to expose their backside in attempt to escape death or severe bodily harm.

It's hard to believe this one actually had to be codified anywhere in the USA!

surv

[banana380]

I find it hard to believe that ANYTHING needs to be codified in the USA. If only people could read the second amendment for what it is, there would be absolutely no need for gun laws. More laws against fucktards perhaps, but no gun laws. Any gun laws, IMO, are a direct infringement upon our right to keep and bear arms.

[pocketgun]

+1.

Imagine if they treated the 1st Amendment like they do the 2nd.

[jimisbell]

+1.

Imagine if they treated the 1st Amendment like they do the 2nd.

In actuality, they do. If you want to speak on a soapbox in a public park, in many states, you need a permit!!!!

[argo]

Is the "Castle Doctrine" the same thing?

[jimisbell]

Yes, I think it is. Here Texas if you are on your home turf (car, boat, motorhome, house) it is your "castle" and you are allowed, if you feel threatened, to take what ever action you need to take to eliminate that threat. I think I would not want to contest it in court, but I have been told that even if he/she is fleeing, you can shoot them in the back. Before that doctrine was codified in law, it was an unwritten law, often repeated by law officers, that if you shot them outside the house you should drag them into the house before you call the law. NOW, outside the house, but still inside your property line is fair game according to the law.

[magman454]

I don't know how I missed this one. The Stand Your Ground Law has little to do with homeowners, as the article in the first post implies. Florida already had the Castle Doctrine which allowed one to not have to attempt retreat before resorting to deadly force if one were in their home or place of business. If one felt threatened, that was enough. However, the threat had to break the threshold of the building before deadly force was legal, even if they were on your front porch shooting at you through the window. As stupid as that seems, that is the way the law was written.

It was later expanded to include personally owned conviences: Cars, trucks, motor-homes, boats, etc., in the early to mid 1980's when there seemed to be a rash of carjackings going on.

After the CCW law was passed in the late 1980's, one was still required by law to attempt to retreat from a threat before resorting to deadly force if the confrontation took place in any location not covered by the Castle Doctrine. What the Stand Your Ground Law did was basically apply the principles of the Castle Doctrine to anyplace in or at which you could legally be. No longer do you have to try to outrun a guy coming at you with a knife in the parking lot before drawing your weapon. Now you can teach him the error of his ways without having to attempt to catch your breath first.

The only way that homeowners in particular benefit from the law is that now, even if they are shooting at you from across the street, you can respond with deadly force without having to wait for them to come through a door or window. You can chamber a round in your .270 and turn off their lights from inside your house, and be perfectly legal.

All of the above is written with Florida State Law in mind. Your State laws may vary.

Before that doctrine was codified in law, it was an unwritten law, often repeated by law officers, that if you shot them outside the house you should drag them into the house before you call the law.

That may have worked in the 70's, but doing that today would land you a murder charge whether you live in a State that has a Castle Doctrine, Stand Your Ground Law, or none of the above. Even if in your State you have no protection of the law such as the ones listed above, you are better off not moving the body if you are in a self defense shooting inside or outside your home. It is quite easy these days to determine whether or not the location of the body is where the perp was shot, and whether or not he made it to the alternate location under his own power. If it is determined that you tampered with evidence you will be suspected of murder, even if the shooting was completely justified.

Even with no protection of law, I would much rather argue that I had to shoot versus having to do that AND convince the jury that I didn't move the body to make a murder look like a self defense shooting.

[jimisbell]

Well,

1) the stand your ground law must mean something else in Florida. But in Texas it means you dont have to retreat to be considered under attack. It means that in Texas you can stand and fight...if you are on your own turf. Definitely has EVERYTHING to do with homeowners!!!!

2) Dragging a body inside was suggested back when you could not shoot them in the yard. Its no longer suggested.

3) I think you are wrong about CA open carry of unloaded weapon. I lived in CA in the 50s and Open Carry was perfectly legal, loaded or not....but a strap over the hammer made it a concealed weapon, which WAS NOT LEGAL.

[magman454]

Well,

1) the stand your ground law must mean something else in Florida. But in Texas it means you dont have to retreat to be considered under attack. It means that in Texas you can stand and fight...if you are on your own turf. Definitely has EVERYTHING to do with homeowners!!!!

No need to get testy. By that definition, it is different in Florida. You don't have to attempt to retreat from a threat before resorting to deadly force no matter where you are in Florida. Home turf or not. You just have to be somewhere where you can legally be. In other words: Not at a location where Florida Law prohibits the carry of a concealed weapon (If you are using or carrying a weapon.), or at a location where you have previously been issued a trespass warning.

2) Dragging a body inside was suggested back when you could not shoot them in the yard. Its no longer suggested.

As is illustrated above, State and Local Laws can and do differ. The original post was about Florida law, and that is upon which I based my perspective. In my statement above I was merely clarifying for those who do not have Castle Doctrine or Stand Your Ground protection of law, and may be tempted to do such a thing after a self defense shooting in an attempt to bolster their self defense stance, that they should not attempt it. They will be caught, and it will not be good for them.

3) I think you are wrong about CA open carry of unloaded weapon. I lived in CA in the 50s and Open Carry was perfectly legal, loaded or not....but a strap over the hammer made it a concealed weapon, which WAS NOT LEGAL.

A lot has changed in CA since the 50's: Pistols are now required to have loaded chamber indicators; Magazines with a capacity over ten rounds are banned; The AWB of 1984 was strengthened, and permanently instilled in the Laws of the State; .50 caliber rifles are banned; CA CCW's are more rare than unicorns; I could go on, but I think I've made my point here. To say that CA is a very un-gun friendly State is putting it mildly.